Episode Summary
In this episode of The Expat Files, Johnny Mueller dives into the complexities of gift-giving in Latin America, from the challenges of choosing the right gift to the cultural significance of fashion and interior design. He also touches on the economic and social dynamics of everyday life, including the surprising issue of toilet seats and the cost of starting a business in the region. Whether you're an expat or simply curious about Latin American culture, this episode offers a unique and insightful perspective.
Johnny begins by discussing the challenges of gift-giving in Latin America, emphasizing that giving gifts that align with the recipient's interests is more effective than giving something they need. He shares personal anecdotes about receiving clothes from family, which he finds impractical, and expresses a preference for gadgets or tools. He also comments on the lack of fashion sense among Latin American men, comparing them unfavorably to first-world men, and suggests that expats should let their partners handle clothing and home decor choices to avoid fashion-related insults. Johnny also warns against giving artwork or decorative items as gifts, as they are often discarded or given to others. The segment concludes with a general observation about the lack of style in Latin American men and the abundance of gift-giving during the holiday season.
He then critiques the common belief that wealth equates to good taste in Latin America, pointing out that many wealthy individuals in the region lack an understanding of interior design principles. He uses examples like Liberace and Elvis Presley to illustrate how even celebrities with significant wealth can have poor taste in home decor. Johnny highlights the contrast between the few wealthy individuals who appreciate and maintain historic Spanish colonial homes and the majority who do not. He then shifts focus to the practice of gift-giving, noting that while Latins are appreciative of gifts, they often reciprocate with religious artifacts, which can be problematic for expats. He includes anecdotes about receiving items like vials of saint's bones and even a piece of the cross, which expats often find difficult to discard. Finally, he offers advice on what to give to lower-class Latin individuals, suggesting t-shirts with English sayings as a popular and appreciated gift.
Johnny humorously discusses the cultural and economic habits of Latin American families, particularly their tendency to reuse and not replace worn-out toilet seats. He notes that even though expats recognize the need for better toilet seats, it's often too embarrassing or socially awkward to bring it up. Johnny also highlights the broader implications of this issue, suggesting that it presents an opportunity for expats to start small businesses by addressing such overlooked needs in the region.
The podcast segment discusses the challenges of giving a toilet seat as a gift in Latin America, highlighting the cultural and social context of such an item. Johnny recounts a story about an expat named Eddie who tried to give a toilet seat as a gift but faced potential embarrassment. The segment also touches on the broader issue of poor customer service and lack of basic amenities in public bathrooms in Latin American businesses. Johnny explores the idea of giving a toilet seat as a gift without causing offense, suggesting various methods like anonymous delivery, but ultimately concludes that it's difficult to do so without causing embarrassment. The segment transitions into a discussion about starting a small business in Latin America, mentioning the average start-up costs for small businesses in different countries, with a focus on the United States and Western Europe.
In this segment, Johnny Mueller discusses the costs of opening a small, traditional brick-and-mortar business in various countries, comparing the expenses across different regions. He starts by mentioning that in Western Europe, the cost is around $110,000 to $125,000, and in the United States, it's approximately $100,000. He then contrasts these figures with the costs in Latin American countries, highlighting that opening the same type of business in Costa Rica costs about $39,700, Brazil $17,500, and Guatemala $7,500. He notes that the costs in countries like El Salvador, Nicaragua, Belize, and Honduras are slightly lower than in Guatemala, but not significantly enough to make a major difference. Johnny also mentions that in some Latin American countries, such as Bolivia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Peru, and Venezuela, the costs are much higher than in the lower-cost countries. He explains that the higher costs in countries like Costa Rica, Argentina, Chile, and Panama are due to higher labor costs, rents, and government fees. Finally, he advises against recommending these higher-cost countries for expats or entrepreneurs, suggesting that they are not suitable for living or running a business unless one has substantial financial resources.
Johnny discusses the current state of real estate and investment opportunities in Latin American countries like Costa Rica, Panama, Chile, and Argentina. He notes that these countries were once affordable for first-world individuals but have become expensive and overpopulated with expats. Johnny warns that the high demand has led to inflated prices and a bubble-like situation, especially in Costa Rica and Panama. He emphasizes that these places are not suitable for long-term living or investment unless one has substantial financial resources. Additionally, he highlights the cultural impact of expat influx, noting that local people have become more transactional and less hospitable due to the influx of gringo dollars. Johnny concludes by suggesting that expats should consider less touristy, off-the-beaten-path countries in Latin America for a more authentic experience.
The segment wraps up the episode, thanking the audience and encouraging them to reach out with questions or comments about Latin America. Johnny Mueller reminds listeners of the email address for contacting him and signs off for the next episode.
Topics
Gift-giving in Latin America, Fashion sense and style, Cultural observations, Expat experiences, Personal anecdotes, Interior design in Latin America, Cultural dynamics of gift-giving, Religious artifacts as gifts, Cultural habits in Latin America, Economic constraints and recycling, Toilet seat issues in Latin American homes, Opportunities for expats in the region
Chapters
00:00:00 Opening 00:00:59 The Preference for Practical Gifts Over Clothes 00:01:06 The Value of Electronic Gadgets for Men 00:01:38 Comparing Fashion Sense Between First-World and Latin American Men 00:04:26 The Belief That Wealth Equals Good Taste in Latin America 00:05:15 The Contrast Between Wealth and Taste in Interior Design 00:06:07 Gift-Giving and Reciprocation in Latin America 00:08:44 The Enthrallment of English Language Items 00:09:06 The Embarrassment of Giving a Toilet Seat 00:09:45 The Need for a Toilet Seat in Latin American Houses 00:13:19 The Toilet Seat Incident 00:13:42 What Do You Do? 00:14:48 The Need for Toilet Seats in Latin America 00:17:14 Starting a Small Business Down Here 00:18:22 Cost Comparison of Small Business Startup Costs in Different Countries 00:18:56 Cost of Opening a Small Business in Brazil and Guatemala 00:19:59 Higher Startup Costs in Certain Latin American Countries 00:22:37 The Cost of Living in Latin America Has Increased 00:22:43 The Popularity of Costa Rica and Panama for Expats 00:22:44 The Inflation of Prices in Popular Expat Destinations 00:22:47 The Cultural Impact of Expats on Local Communities 00:22:53 The Reality of Living in Expensive Countries 00:22:58 The Need for First-World Income to Live Comfortably 00:23:03 The Importance of Knowing Where the Wealthy Live 00:23:07 The Accessibility of Wealthy Neighborhoods 00:27:36 Closing Remarks and Episode Sign-Off
Transcript
Automatically transcribed from the original recording; names and wording may contain errors.
[00:03] Hi everybody, I'm Johnny Mueller and you're listening to The Expat Files, living in Latin America. The show that tells you what it's really like to live, work, play and or retire in Latin America. I tell it just like it is, not the version they give you in those glossy travel magazines, or the picture they paint for you in those international traveler websites, where they're only trying to sell you something. What's it really like for expats living in Latin America? Well, it's time to take off those rose colored glasses and find out. So let's get started. So what do you give a Latin American friend or family member for Christmas? The best thing of course is not to give them something they need, but to give them something they want. Which is probably the best policy for any kind of gift giving, whether it's Christmas or a birthday or whatever, first world or third world. Take my case for example, my mother and the girls in my family always give me some kind
[00:52] of clothes, which of course I appreciate, but once you've opened the package and shoved them in your drawer, that's the very last time you ever think about them. I'd really much rather have some kind of electronic gadget or a tool, you know how guys are. But women are reluctant to give us that kind of stuff. There's nothing like a nice disc sander or a hammer drill to make a guy really happy on Christmas day. But alas, we almost never get that stuff, not from the women folk. And of course in my case, I know the girls and my mother are trying to tell me something that I've really got no fashion sense at all. And that's why they keep buying me clothes. And that no fashion sense club that I belong to has a huge membership. Just ask your wife or girlfriend. But as for taste in class folks, I have to tell you that any first world guy who has a solid 5 in fashion sense, or even less than mediocre, shoots to the very top of the class
[01:38] in fashion and taste when you compare him with the average latin guy. And it's not only the fact that down here in latin america, scant few guys look like Antonio Banderas or Julio Iglesias. And besides those guys aren't from latin america, they're from Spain. But suffice it to say, even the lowest classes of latin american guys down here, and the ones in the very highest classes, well, compared to the average first world gringo, these guys have the taste of a bronx garbage man. I'm talking about the men of course, not the latin women. They always seem to be a couple of notches above the men in taste and style. Then again, so are women everywhere, don't you think? All you have to do is walk into any one of your male latin friends houses and you'll see exactly what I mean. It's early american trailer court all the way. Not only are the colors all over the place and nothing matches, the vast majority of
[02:23] them live in unbelievable clutter and throw almost nothing away. And though some first world gringos I know live just like that too, quite a few of my friends up north have very good taste. And I have to admit much better than mine, and that's why I've always recommended to my first world friends that when living up there in Boise or Indianapolis, you should always let your wife or girlfriend pick out your clothes, color coordinate you, and select all your artwork and furniture for your house or apartment. And in that case you'll never go wrong because your significant other and the ladies in your family will always approve of you and will probably never insult your fashion sense. Not to your face anyway. Or call you a scumbag because they had a big hand in creating your style. And as long as you keep yourself and your place relatively clean, they'll have no good reason to call you a scumbag in mixed company. Which brings me to an observation my smart mother once said.
[03:09] She said never give as gifts, artwork, or adornments for somebody else's house because everybody's taste is different. Which I know is very wise advice because every time someone's ever given me some artwork or doodads for my house or apartment, they inevitably made a quick trip to the attic or the basement, or got repackaged and sent to somebody else as a gift. Usually an acquaintance I didn't care much for, but got invited to their wedding somehow, so naturally I had to give them something. And speaking of weddings, that's a whole other subject. And you could be sure I'll be talking about third world weddings on a future show, so stay tuned. But anyway, we're talking about gift giving down here in the third world, in Latin America. And very appropriate too, since it's Christmas time. And there's a lot of that going around down here. A lot of parties, believe me. Now because the average Latin male, and even the way above average wealthy Latin male,
[03:56] seem to have so very little decorative or fashion sense at all, that means when it's gift giving time, you could give them practically anything and they'll be happy about it. Because if you were born with no style or fashion sense, then I guess everything looks good to you. At least that's what I've been told. Because I have that problem myself. Everything looks good to me. Sometimes, any new gift at all, no matter how hideous, ends up in a prominent place in the house. Even if it looks out of place and doesn't match a thing. Because chances are, almost everything else in the house doesn't match either. And I'm even talking about people who have tons of money, and who can afford to have the very best. But do you think they'd take that extra step and go out and hire an interior decorator? Well, no. That just doesn't seem to be the case. Instead, there seems to be a little ego problem among people down here who have money.
[04:42] For some reason, they think with money comes taste. But it doesn't. We all know that. Take Liberace and Elvis Presley, for example. And that's why, if you have a career down here as an interior decorator, you're just going to starve. Unless, of course, you work for one of the big department stores that sells furniture, and then you can get a job decorating the store. But most of the time, people who buy that furniture never seem to take your advice or even take the hint that mixing and matching 10 different styles of furniture in a house, no matter how elegant and expensive that furniture might be, is just not the way to go. And in the end, it just demonstrates the owner's bad taste. But that's not to say that some people in Latin America don't have really great taste. The problem is, even the rich people have never heard of the phrase, less is more. So every interior seems to be completely cluttered up. Though once in a while, a wealthy person will live in a fabulous Spanish colonial home,
[05:31] an original that's two or even three hundred years old. And some of the owners, the smart ones, have chosen to leave it in the Spanish colonial style. All the furniture, antiques, and all the woodwork original, properly restored, of course. And you see some of these now and again in the old historic districts in all the big Latin American cities that were once colonial Spanish towns. And some of these houses, inside and out, are absolutely spectacular. However, only a tiny percentage of the wealthy people that own these places ever do them justice. In fact, I've been in a lot of these tremendous houses, and inside, sometimes it looks like a garage sale. But thankfully, not all. So anyway, when it comes to gift giving, anything goes. And you should know that Latins of all classes are very appreciative of anything you might give them. But do beware, when a Latin person gives you a gift in return, whether it's your birthday
[06:19] or your wedding or whatever, you just might be given a gift that's so hideous you wouldn't put it in your doghouse. And I can't even give you a suggestion on what to do about it, because when they come to visit, I'm sure they'll be glancing around looking for it. And here's the thing, Latins are really big at giving gifts that are religious artifacts. Pictures and statues of Jesus and the saints in Bible paintings. In fact, that was once given a framed holy card with a saint's picture on it, and inscribed with a biblical phrase. And underneath there was a hermetically sealed vial, which was supposed to have a piece of the actual bone of the finger of the saint who died. So I ask you, what do you do when you get that kind of junk? And it's not like I haven't had this conversation before with other gringos. In fact, two of my Jewish friends down here who work in the clothing business have told me that when Christmas time comes, they get presents from their employees too.
[07:06] And inevitably, they get the Jesus stuff. And you know, to them, Jesus was just another 2,000 year old guy, nothing special. They're still waiting for theirs. So I ask them, you know, what do you do with that stuff once you get it? And they both said they can't really keep it around the house or even store it, because when the relatives from New York or New Jersey come down, well, they can't let them see that stuff. So I never did get a straight answer. Anyway, all of us expats know, the longer we're down here, the more religious presents we're gonna get. So you gotta handle that yourself. But whatever you do, even though you know that Latin people just love religious themed presents, don't ever give a present like that to one of them. Because you're just opening the door to receive a lot of junk like that in reciprocation. And by the way, all of you expats and expat wannabes up there who are into Jesus, disregard what I've just said, okay? And by the way, if you want to know the craziest gift expat Eddie ever got from one of his
[07:54] Latin employees, he was once given a sealed glass box with a certified letter inside of it. And in that glass box was a clear capsule containing a tiny sliver of petrified wood. And the certified letter said that the piece of wood was an actual sliver of the cross that Jesus carried on the calvary. And Eddie thought that was so interesting, he didn't have the heart to toss it. So where is it now? Well, it's in his garage in a prominent place of importance, hanging right between his snap-on tools calendar and his Pamela Anderson poster. Anyway, in a previous show I told you, the best gift you could give to a very low-class Latin, the ones that make two or three hundred bucks a month, like the gardener or the maintenance man or the cleaning lady or the kids of the cleaning lady. Well, like I said before, one of the best gifts you could possibly give are t-shirts
[08:42] with English sayings on them. And it doesn't matter what kind of English saying, as long as the letters are in English and it comes from the first world, then a lower-class Latin person is absolutely enthralled. And believe it or not, even if it's a t-shirt with a very vulgar saying on it, well, the lower-class Latins don't know the difference, they don't really know what it says, they don't read or speak English. So anything goes, t-shirt wise, as long as the words and the letters are in English. But you know, to be perfectly honest with you, and though this sounds terribly classist of me, there is one particular gift that nearly every Latin American family is in dire need of but they don't seem to realize it, though us expats recognize it nearly every time we walk into a Latin American's house, and we'd love to make them a nice gift of a brand new one, but it would just be way too embarrassing to do it, or even bring it up for that matter.
[09:29] It would be a very touchy point indeed. And it doesn't seem to matter if you're in a low or a high-class Latin's house, they're in dire need of this particular item. And folks, what I'm talking about now, and though this might sound strange to you, and don't laugh please, because it's no joke, but I'm saying that nearly all Latin American houses are lacking a toilet seat that's in serviceable decent condition. And us expats still can't figure out for the life of us why Latin families just don't go out and drop 15 bucks on a decent toilet seat. I mean, don't at least your gringo guests deserve a good stress-free sit-down? Not a toilet seat with the paint missing, with the wood showing through, because the poor old seat is so worn, after 10,000 sittings of 10,000 butts, I mean, come on, Latins, wake up!
[10:15] A toilet seat has a limited lifespan, and it's not 25 years. And sure, it has a lot to do with the fact that 85-90% of Latins don't even make a thousand bucks a month, and because of that, they practically recycle everything and throw nothing away until it's absolutely unserviceable, and certainly, you can forgive a lot of that in the rest of the house. But don't let skimp on the toilet seat, please! Now of course, this doesn't happen in new houses, but most people don't have a new house down here. So the 95% of the people rich and poor with an old or existing house? Well, if you visit one of those places, you can be sure when you walk into that bathroom that once you take a look at that toilet seat, you're going to want to summon up some intestinal fortitude and wait till you get home. And it seems that when new expats get down here, they notice that phenomena in a hurry.
[11:01] They not only notice it in the average Latin American's home, they notice the very same thing in the bathrooms of restaurants and bars and diners and clubs, and even in the so-called high-end tourist districts, where it might be that almost everything else in the place looks kind of first world and you actually expect it to be that way. But no. Now the fact that I'm talking about this at all certainly has to wake you up to the fact that like I said, down here in Latin America, there are tremendous opportunities for first world expats coming down looking to start a small business. The fact is, we notice those little details like bad toilet seats, and the locals just don't, and especially in the restaurant and service industry, having a nicely appointed bathroom could make all the difference in whether your business is going to be a success or not, especially in the restaurant business, and it's such a simple thing, and you know
[11:50] damn well you'd never let that happen in your own house, or in a restaurant or bar that you might be opening. Who says you can't judge a man by his toilet? Well you do in the first world now, don't you? And usually, the state of the toilet seat is not the only unpleasant thing you see in the average Latin American's bathroom, but it's the one thing that could be totally corrected for 15 bucks at the nearest hardware store. So why doesn't someone just make the trip? Me and my expat friends just don't get it. I mean, even if the family's so broke that they only make 300 bucks a month, 15 bucks isn't going to send anybody to the poor house, because well, they're already in the poor house right? Okay, that's not funny, sorry about that. And one day, me and expat Eddie were talking about the subject, because we'd seen one too many bad toilet seats that week. And he said, hey look, if they're worried about the 15 bucks, why can't they just drop
[12:37] a dollar on a can of white spray paint, sand it down and give it a fresh coat? That'll freshen up any toilet seat for a year or two. But then he said, you know, Latins don't think that way. Then I said, Eddie, you know, the only way they're going to get a new toilet seat is if the old one actually breaks in half. Then Eddie laughed and said, you know, I tried that already, it doesn't work. Then he told me the story about his girlfriend's parents' house. Their ancient toilet seat was plastic and it was worn so thin, by so much intimate contact, that Eddie said it was about as thick as a frisbee and you can almost see right through it. And Eddie didn't want to insult the parents by saying, hey, I'll buy you a new toilet seat. He didn't want to press his luck because he was already persona non grata in the house, because he'd gotten stinko at one of the birthday parties over there and dropped a cake on the floor and broke a few dishes. So instead of insulting the family by saying their toilet seat wasn't up to his first world
[13:25] standards, one day he just stepped on it, broke it in half and left it laying on the bathroom floor. And a few days later, when he came back with his girlfriend and had to use the bathroom, he went inside and guess what, that toilet seat was back on the toilet again taped together with duct tape. Yep, another one of those thousand and one uses for duct tape, I guess. So anyway, what do you do? And Eddie's next idea was just to buy a brand new toilet seat, wrap it up and secretly put it under the Christmas tree and pretend that Santa brought it. But Eddie didn't end up doing that, because he knew at present opening time, he'd probably give himself away. Because the thing is, like Eddie said, if you give someone a toilet seat for a present, some people would certainly take that as an insult. It could be quite embarrassing, in fact, I guess it would be like giving your grandpa a gift certificate for a year's supply, it depends. If you did that, the family would probably never stop joking about it, and your grandpa
[14:13] might never speak to you again. I mean, imagine it yourself, up in the first world, up in Idaho or Cleveland or wherever, if someone presented you or your family with a brand new toilet seat, and they were dead serious about it, that just might be the end of a beautiful friendship now, wouldn't it? Then I said to Expat Eddie, how about an anonymous delivery boy drops one off at the front door? Well, that might work, but they'd probably suspect Eddie, because who but a first world person would ever do something like that? But nevertheless, I just can't think of a good way to give a toilet seat as a gift, since practically every Latin American family could use one. And that includes 95% of all the Latin American businesses that have a public bathroom too. And there's only one thing worse than having a toilet seat that's so worn out, it's got
[14:58] butt prints in it. And that is, when you go to the bathroom and there's no seat there at all, it's gone. Now I know in the first world, that's not completely uncommon, in really bad sections of town, and sometimes in scummy off the main route gas station bathrooms, but down here in Latin America you see that quite a bit in business establishments, including a lot of middle class restaurants and bars. And when I first started noticing that, I was thinking, man this is terrible customer service, how could a business get away with that? And I thought that way for a long time, until I ran into a guy who owned a little diner, a ways off the main beach in Panama City, Panama, and he told me the reason why he didn't have a toilet seat in his public bathroom, was because the last three seats he had in there got stolen. Which, in a way, gives you an idea of just how poor the very lowest class of society is down here, when they'll steal a toilet seat, a used toilet seat, from a public bathroom.
[15:48] So anyway, how do you give the gift that keeps on giving, a toilet seat that is, without causing a lot of red faces, pregnant pauses, and embarrassment, bluntly put, without insinuating that the family members are a bunch of unsanitary scumbags. Which is certainly what people would think if you bought them a toilet seat up in the first world. Well, I just don't know. So all you expats and expat wannabes up there, if you got any ideas how to break it to them gently, send me an email. And now I'd like to talk about something I think most of you expat wannabes especially are really going to be interested in. Now like I've said so many times before, first world visitors and new expats come down here with either a plan in mind to start a small business, or after traveling quite a bit down here and stumbling around, they've thought of a number of small businesses that they could get into that could really make money. And the longer you're down here, the more those ideas pop into your head as you see
[16:36] how much is lacking down here in basic business entrepreneurship, customer service and just plain lack of first world style details. Those basic details that Latin businessmen down here just don't see because they didn't live up in the first world like you. So anyway, suppose you do have a great idea for a small business. I get emails all the time asking what are the set up costs. Well, here's what I can tell you. If you're not talking about a franchise, because if you do buy a franchise you'll be paying that big franchise fee right off the bat. So instead, let's talk about setting up a small business of your own idea in a building that you don't own, but are just renting. That's normally the case for first time business owners. They nearly always rent. And now here's the great news for all you guys who want to start a small business down here. There's a recent report put together by a well-known not-for-profit business organization
[17:23] out of London called Global Entrepreneurship Monitor. They've just listed the average start-up costs for small businesses with under 10 employees who rent, and they've listed the average cost of doing this in over 100 countries. Now when you're talking about the United States, it costs on average about $100,000 to open a small business like this. That's the kind of cash you're going to have to have on hand before you even open the doors. Now in most countries in Western Europe, it's slightly more than that. Maybe $110,000 to $125,000, and again that's what you're going to dish out before you even open your doors. And by the way, we're talking about traditional brick and mortar businesses now, a place where customers come, spend their money, and get their services or products. Like a pastry shop, or a restaurant, or a mom and pop bed and breakfast. Your basic small business storefronts you see practically everywhere, especially along
[18:12] the tourist routes in the first world and the third world. Okay, so anyway, it costs around $100,000 to open up a business like that in the United States. So we'll use that as a comparison. Now listen to this. If you want to open up that very same small business in Costa Rica, it's going to cost $39,700 US dollars, about a third of what it costs in the United States. Now doesn't that sound like a great deal? So why not let's all head down to Costa Rica, right? Well maybe not. Not when you can go to Brazil and open the very same business for $17,500. About half of what you'd pay to open up that very same business in Costa Rica and 20% of what you'd pay to open up that very same business in the United States. Sounds like a great deal. Let's go down to Brazil, right?
[18:58] Well maybe not. How about let's go down to Guatemala, where that very same small business is going to cost you to open $7,500, less than half of the cost of opening that very same business in Brazil, and about one sixth of the cost of opening that very same business in Costa Rica, and less than 10% of what it would cost to open that same business in the United States. Alright, so let's go down to Guatemala and open a business, right? Well maybe, maybe not. Because if you go to one of the neighboring countries like El Salvador or Nicaragua or Belize or Honduras, you'll pay about $6,000 to open that very same business, slightly less than in Guatemala, not much less, actually not enough to make a big difference in your pocketbook. Now some of the other Latin countries that come in around $6,000 to $7,000 to open a
[19:45] small business are Bolivia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Peru, and Venezuela, and those Latin American countries that rank among the highest, where you pay five, six, or even seven times as much to open up a small business than the countries I just mentioned. Well along with Costa Rica, you can include Argentina, Chile, Panama, and Mexico. And by just looking at those small business average startup numbers, you get a really good idea of the labor cost in all those countries, and where those startup costs are high like in Costa Rica, Argentina, Chile, and Panama, it's obvious that the labor costs must be double or triple or even more than those other countries I mentioned, where it costs about $6,000 to open a business like Guatemala, Salvador, Belize, Nicaragua, and Honduras, to name just a few. And also in those higher priced business startup countries like Costa Rica and Chile, it's
[20:33] obvious too that the rents are higher, because those rent expenses too are highly weighted in startup costs. And then there's the cost of government permits, inspections, and paperwork, as well as licensing fees and all that, which are also reflected highly in the startup costs, which means in countries like Costa Rica, Panama, Chile, and Argentina, you're obviously going to have much heavier government startup fees than you will in countries like Guatemala, Bolivia, Ecuador, El Salvador, and Paraguay. And having said all that, I have to say that I'm still getting emails from people that ask all the time, where are the best places in Panama and Costa Rica specifically, since so many people seem to have their minds focused on those two countries, I get a lot of emails about them. Well, once again, I'll repeat. I don't recommend Costa Rica, Panama, Argentina, Chile, Venezuela, or Mexico.
[21:21] Those are the countries I do not recommend. You live, work, retire, and or play or open a business, unless you have a lot of money. So it's like this. I have absolutely nothing against those countries at all, and there are some really great places to live there. But I'm not the kind of person who wants to live in a third world country and live like a first world person does, which I love to do, and pay first world prices that I don't want to do. Because if I just avoid four or five of the 20 Latin American countries, Mexico, Panama, Costa Rica, Chile, and Argentina, I can live exactly like a first world person or even better on a half to a third of what it takes for you to live like a first world person in Costa Rica, Mexico, Panama, Argentina, and Chile. So unless I was Mr. Moneybags, why would I want to live there?
[22:07] And when I get emails from people saying, Johnny, I just got back from Costa Rica or Panama or Chile or Argentina, and I can't live like a king on $10,000 like you said you can in Latin America, please tell me a place in Panama or Costa Rica where I can. I'm all ears. Well, you know what? You're not all ears because you're not listening to me. I said you cannot live on $10,000 a year in Costa Rica, not anymore. Not like a first world person you can't. You can live like a local, which isn't very good, but the last time you could really live like a first worlder for $10,000 was back in 1995, about 15, 16 years ago. But those days are long gone. Same thing in Panama, Chile, and Argentina. So please dear listeners, don't send me emails asking me where is the best place to live
[22:53] work, play, or open a business in Costa Rica or Panama or Argentina or Chile, because the thing is, if you have a first world income or a big time, highly funded pension account, you can go down to any one of those countries, find out where the wealthy people live, and you'll know that by the nicely manicured gated communities, or when you arrive, just ask any taxi driver to take you to the neighborhood where the American ambassador lives or where all the wealthy people have their beach houses, and you can just move into that neighborhood or set up shop there. If you have that kind of first world money, you don't need me to give you any suggestions. But the thing is, if you've got religion about Panama and Costa Rica, which seems to be the populist favorites right now for first world people looking to get off the treadmill up there, and I mentioned in passing Chile and Argentina are very high priced now too, and
[23:40] you won't be living the high life unless you have a first world income or near a first world income, not in those two countries. Anyway, no matter how much first world people might want to go to Chile or Argentina, they almost never end up there. It's just too damn far away, a very long trip, and a very expensive trip too. The round trip flights from the states are often around a thousand bucks, and depending where you are in the states, the flights down to South America are 6, 8, or 10 hours and even more if you have to do a connecting flight. So it's a bit difficult to get down there, not at all like going to Panama or Costa Rica, where you might be facing only a 3 or 3 and a half hour flight, and there's so many airlines going down that you can often get a round trip flight for around 250 to 300 bucks. So the way it works out is this, there's about 20 times as many people going down to Costa
[24:26] Rica and Panama than South America. There's a lot of cheap package destinations for Panama and Costa Rica. If you look around, 5 to 7 days can cost you from 6 to 700 bucks. But if you did that same kind of trip to Chile or Argentina, you'd probably pay 2 or 3 thousand dollars unless you hooked up with one of those last minute air flight deals, which is usually out of the question for most people. My point is now that so many people seem to have religion about Costa Rica and Panama, it seems that no matter what I say and how I try to steer people away from those places, I don't seem to be getting through to some of you. So if I can convince you that down here in Latin America there are so many better places, just as nice if not nicer than Panama or Costa Rica, at a half or a third of the cost, maybe if you look at it like a stock market or real estate bubble, you'll get a better handle
[25:12] on why it's not a good idea to live or invest there. It's well known in the investment community when everybody seems to be jumping in the market with both feet, and the average working guy and cab driver are in the market too, and even your barber seems to know the flavor of the day's stock to invest in, well by then the market's shot, it's over, that's the peak of the bubble. Well isn't it funny that these days everybody seems to know someone who's been to Costa Rica or Panama? Go ahead and ask around at a family gathering, and I'll bet a half dozen, maybe even a dozen people have already been there, and everybody who has is talking about going back and investing in a one of a kind property on the beach, or seriously thinking about retiring in an upscale community down there. Well isn't it funny that nobody's talking about Bolivia or Paraguay or Peru or Honduras
[25:58] or Belize or Salvador? No, it's Costa Rica and Panama right? Well that my friends means bubble. So the bottom line is, if you want to go down, bring some first world cash with you because that's what it's going to cost you to live like a first world person down there. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that of course. Well if you think I'm blowing air, just know this, I lived in Costa Rica for 3 years, had a few businesses, owned two houses, and watched the prices and the craziness escalate, month over month. And I saw the signs of what was coming back then, back in 1995 to 98, and would I ever go back down there? Sure, to visit, but I'd never want to live or do business there. Besides the fact that we're talking about first world pricing all over the place down there, there's been some sad unintended secondary effects.
[26:44] Tourism has become their number one industry, so the place has become absolutely flooded with gringo dollars. And those dollars have contaminated the once friendly, unassuming Costa Rican people. So just know this, when a Costa Rican cab driver takes your luggage out of his cab, smiles at you, and holds out his hand for a tip, he's not at your service because he's so happy to see foreigners come in and enjoy his wonderful country, he's giving you that practice smile, because to him, you're nothing but a dollar sign. And that's why I always prefer to go to Latin American countries off the tourist trail, where you can walk around all day and practically never seeing a gringo at all. Because in those places, the people really are happy to see foreigners, and want to show you their lovely country. And when you give them a $5 tip, chances are they're not at all expecting it, and are
[27:30] genuinely surprised. You've been listening to The Expat Files, living in Latin America, coming to you each week from somewhere south of the border. And don't forget, you can email me on anything at all about Latin America, theexpatfiles at gmail.com. Once again, theexpatfiles at gmail.com. See you next time, on the Spamos.