#1394 – Navigating Legal and Cultural Challenges in Latin America with Johnny Mueller

Automatically transcribed from the original recording; names and wording may contain errors.

[00:00] South of the border down Mexico way That's where I fell in love when the stars above came up to play and now I wonder Hello there all you ex-pad wannabes. I'm Johnny Mueller and you're listening to the expat files living in Latin America The show that tells you just what it's like to live work play and or retire down here in Latin America It's a mix of the good the bad the ugly and the great and it's all right here. So let's get started Alright, we're back in the studio again. So the mic should sound a little better You know occasionally gringos and expats get picked up by the cops Could be a matter of just wrong place wrong time Could be just a routine stop and your papers aren't in order or you forgot your papers

[00:49] Say like your own ID or car registration papers, etc The thing is though if you're getting pulled over cuz it's a shakedown, you know the traditional more Dita Cops just looking for a bribe kind of thing. Well, I can tell you it's just a scare. They're just out for a bribe They're not gonna take you down to the station No matter how many times they tell you they're gonna do it And of course the age-old way of figuring that out is when you're talking with the cop Depending how well you can communicate with them because most gringos and expats Spanish sucks So you'll probably be using some phone translate app like Google Translate, which I hate Anything connected with Google I hate because they collect everything on you They're scraping every last bit of data on you. They can remember when it's free you are the product anyway

[01:37] The very easiest way to find out if it's a shakedown and you could get out of it by paying them in 20 or 50 Bucks, whatever here's a tip if it seems like you're getting nowhere And they're not actually writing a genuine ticket out for you You know for a transit violation or whatever you have to step up just say something like look Can I pay my ticket right now? And if they say yes, they often do that's when the negotiation begins by the way if your driver's license whether it's a license from up in the states or a License you obtained because you got residency in a Latin American country if it's out of date if it's expired Called Vincido in Spanish believe it or not. It's just fine unlike in the states where they could take your car and haul you down To the station because up there. They won't let you drive on an expired license down here in Latin America

[02:27] It's just a fine So then the cop might give you a ticket then you drive on away The fines generally around 35 to 50 bucks depending on the Latin American country you're in you know that Itself is an amazing thing. They don't haul you down to the station or a pound your car They just give you a 35 or $50 ticket That's the way it's supposed to be anyway But get this and all the 30 years I've been down here to Latin America and all the gringos and expats I've known I've known dozens who've been driving on expired US licenses for years. Hell. I'm guilty of it, too And eventually you know you do get pulled over for this or that and when you do you're worried a bit that they'll check The expiration date on your license and find it's no good anymore. Anyway, it's a happy coincidence that I've never met a single gringo Ex-pat who was fined because his driver's license had expired

[03:14] now I'm talking about if you're driving on your expired US driver's license if You're driving on your Plan B countries Latin American driver's license. It's different. They will check your dates And if it's expired, it's a 50-50 chance They'll give you a ticket if it's recently expired within the last couple months still let you slide The thing is if you're from the US It's really in your favor that every single state all 50 of them have a different format for the driver's license Totally confusing for any Latin American cop that might pull you over between the states There's no rhyme or reason where the photo is what colors they use for the background where they put the codes the dates There's just no standardization, which is a good thing for gringos and expats who don't have a Latin American license

[04:00] You know what I'm talking about. Oh, let's not forget the fact that when you live here in Latin America when you write out a date They reverse the positions of the day in the month. In other words, if you're talking about December 1st 2024 for us, it's 12 1 2024 right well down here in Latin America. It's 1 12 2024 which confuses things even more for Latin American cops when they're looking at things like American driver's licenses That's another thing in your favor if you're driving on a US license and it's expired The cops just see that it's an American driver's license and give you a pass. Oh and note There's no possible way they could ever scan your barcodes on your license and check up to see if it's a valid license Or see if you're out of points or whatever again

[04:48] There's no way a Latin American cop could check the validity of your driver's license up in the states By the way, that's something you really should remember on any document down here in Latin America They always always always reverse the month and the day Of course, if you ask Latin Americans, they'd say we people from the states reverse ours that we're doing it the wrong way Because we don't follow their particular format, but it's really important to know that for example When you're looking at credit card or bank statements or when you're booking a hotel, man, you better get it, right? Or you might just show up with your bags at the front desk of a hotel And they've got you down for some other date some other day and month not a very good beginning to a nice vacation Anyway, we were talking about gringles and expats who actually get picked up and taken down to the station. What happens then?

[05:37] Well, if you're a longtime listener to this show, you've heard me say a million times you have your local Latin lawyer on speed dial I know. I know that sounds so quaint and ancient speed dial Only boomers use terms like that, right? So I'll use it. I don't care I like to keep certain outdated old words alive now about that lawyer you have on call In fact, you should have already speed dialed him when you got pulled over and started to see you were getting hassled What do I mean by that? I don't mean they'll physically hassle you but they just may take way too long checking your paperwork In other words, you'll hand them your paperwork. That's in the glove compartment your license car registration, etc they'll generally take a walk over to their own patrol car for a minute or motorcycle whatever and

[06:26] Mull over your paperwork for a minute or two. They know what they're looking for. But if they take too long That's the problem It really only takes a minute or two to go through your paperwork if it takes longer than that Or if there's let's say two or three cops and they're mulling things over It only takes one cop not three cops to mull over your stuff The longer they discuss you and your paperwork in their little circle the more chance you'll be a person of a special interest to them That's when you hit your lawyer on speed dial when you get them on the phone hand the phone over to one of the cops And you're done Believe me 99 out of a hundred times. It's over except Except now if they find something in your car that you suspect might be drugs So then what about open booze in the car? Well, most of the time they won't say a thing about that either

[07:13] What about guns? Well, remember if you have a gun and you have a permit for it, you're okay Normally what the cops will do is when they first get you to roll your window down They'll say porta armas Which means are you carrying a gun now? Of course like anywhere if you have a gun and don't have a permit you're going to the slammer Though like I said, they'll never take you down to the station or mess with you if you have your papers Even if they're not in order But let's say for example, you don't have your lawyer on speed dial or you don't have a lawyer And you don't have your car's paperwork in the glove compartment That can happen Maybe a couple days or weeks previously you were going over the stuff in your house And you forgot to put it back in the car. Maybe you were checking on your insurance policy or renewing it Well, guess what? I've got a worst case story for you here. That's probably gonna blow your mind

[08:03] Let's put it this way. You don't want this to happen to you This is about a gringo expat named George who's been living in Panama now for about seven months Off and on not exactly a permanent expat yet. Just ready to start its residency process Well three or four gringles were sitting around talking about experiences We've had with cops over the years here in latin america And before we even got started with the stories george said hey, hey guys No matter what story you have. I have a better one That was a good opening line because usually I could beat everyone by a mile I said proceed george proceed you're up. He said a couple of weeks ago I had an encounter with some cops. It was the worst day of my life Except for maybe a couple of days. I had during my two divorces. He said He said he was driving along in a residential neighborhood on the outskirts of panama city and

[08:52] He pulled up to a stop sign where there were two cops wearing flak jackets sitting on a motorcycle These weren't transit cops. They were national cops. There's a difference He said from what I can tell they have a little bit different uniforms and the transit cops don't carry guns And are mostly women Anyway, george pulled up to the stop sign One of the cops will stand in there right at the sign And he made a motion for george to lower his window By the way george's spanish not too good at all And the cop said stop roll all your windows down and give me your papers So george gave him his u.s license, which wasn't expired No problem there The cop quickly looked at it as george was rifling through his glove compartment. No papers He left that little envelope with his car title and registration papers in the house

[09:41] Then he explained in his very rudimentary spanish that he lived pretty close by and if they just stopped there He could run in and get him and the cop says no, I don't think so We're going down to the police station and have a little talk with the commandant The cop walked over to the passenger side of george's car and jumped in and his partner revved up the motorcycle And led the way now, of course george was totally inconvenienced by this and he knew things would turn out All right, because he did have paperwork all he had to do is show it He kept trying to say to the cop let's stop at my house. It's only two blocks away I'll get you the paperwork by the way george did not have his lawyer on speed dot turns out He'd been popping in and out of panama for the past six or seven months

[10:27] At first just to visit a retired gringle friend, but mostly just exploring panama on his own So george didn't actually have a latino lawyer yet Though he thought in his mind he'd be applying soon to get residency and then he'd get a lawyer probably His retired gringo buddies lawyer. He hadn't met the lawyer yet or had a meeting with him But he figured sooner or later he'd get around to it So anyway george is driving his car with a cop in the front seat next to him and another cop Driving a motorcycle leading the way a highly unusual circumstance george thought but hey He was in another country and maybe that's just the way things are you thought Now george knows there's a big central police station about 10 blocks away from his house They're heading in that direction till he sees the motorcycle lead in the way take a right turn

[11:17] So he takes a right turn as well He's thinking maybe they're going to a back entrance a cop entrance But no The motorcycle keeps on going farther and farther black after black until he's miles from the central police station Now he's sort of quizzing the cop in his bad spanish How come we didn't stop at the central station? The cop says there are lots of stations. We're going to a different one Where is it? He says don't worry. It's up ahead keep driving follow the motorcycle, but gave no specifics He kept driving and driving and it wasn't up ahead over 20 minutes. He said they're driving Then he sees the traffic thinning out of it Suddenly he gets a scare. He has a very bad feeling about this

[12:02] He's wondering if these guys are really cops at all because he saw no cop id That's you know, usually pinned to the uniform no id tags or badges Now the guy's motorcycle had a government insignia of the police and uh police played on it The two guys had police uniforms, but they were wearing flak jackets with no id badge George was alarmed enough to memorize the plate number of the motorcycle in case he needed to recall it later Because you see george recalled some months earlier going to a panama relocation seminar Where a bunch of residents were having a discussion about crime and extortions in panama and a few stories stuck out in george's mind especially the story about cop impersonators

[12:49] Specifically two cops on a motorcycle driving around extorting expats gringos and wealthier latinos George said they were discussing how to tell if cops were real or imposters though in some cases it was mentioned even real cops Will try to extort people He heard people who were in the know People who had lived in panama a while talking about how that was the preferred method for extortion when it comes to cops Just two cops on one motorcycle stopping people who looked like they had dough or had means Shaking them down sometimes even taking them to an atm and worse yet when it comes to cop imposters That is guys that look like cops But really aren't there have been kidnappings and once they got their victim to a safe house They'd take the phone ring up people in the states and demand money

[13:36] So all those crime stories he heard at that panama relocation seminar were racing through his head So he asked the cop next to him once again. Can I call my lawyer? Can I call my wife? Now he didn't have a lawyer nor did he have a wife But he had a couple of ex-wives in his heightened state if he got the phone call he'd call his gringle buddy Now his phone was in the center console of his car So he reached for it the cop grabbed it out of his hand And said you can make a call after you've talked to the commandant Now george was terrified Nothing seemed right and after driving another 10 minutes and a million things going through his head George asked the cop if he could see his id The cop said what for and george said because it's normal procedure

[14:22] Can I see your id badge? The cop said it's under my flag jacket. You can see it later Then george said what's your name? The guy said louise And george said louise what he said louise is enough for now. Now remember george's spanish really sucks So he's having a hard time understanding the cop when he responds to certain questions There was no google translate going on while they were in the car And now they were in a part of town that george did not recognize at all getting seedier and seedier too Now he was really worried He thought for sure they'd pull up into a driveway and end up in some garage Or safe house and this was a kidnapping He thought that or maybe that they'd want to steal his car But george had an idea. They were still going down a main road and there was some traffic

[15:09] So he figured if he saw another cop car or cop motorcycle anywhere He'd try to get their attention either swerve in front of him or something Now they were on a four-lane road. So sure enough within the next five minutes He saw a police pickup truck patrol car Come up a ramp and merge right next to him with two cops in the front seat with their windows down And two cops in the back truck bed when they merged alongside george Dropped his window down and yelled help help me and laid on the horn that got their attention and the cop car Hit their cherry lights george stopped the cops jumped out came to the window And he tried to explain in his bad spanish that he'd been picked up by two cops He didn't know if there were cops because they wouldn't id themselves Etc, etc As it turned out all the cops knew each other and man were those two motorcycle cops pissed

[15:57] They slapped the cuffs on george threw him into the back of the pickup truck with the other two cops And the cop who was sitting in the front seat next to him the guy that had his phone Took the wheel and drove george's car to the police station, which was another 10 or 15 minutes away Now at this point george was totally relieved. They weren't impostors. They were regular cops Heading to a real police station. He thought he'd be free and clear Well, they sat him down in a little interrogation room a cop with him at all times By the way, he said the place was pretty rustic But they had a big screen tv and the cop sitting with him was watching netflix in spanish, of course He was binging on a cop series an fbi show Anyway george said he got to the interrogation room at around 10 in the morning They parked his car in the cop lot took all his belongings

[16:47] And held on to them in another room They told him he would be questioned by the commentant who would be there anytime now They did not remove the cuffs So he sat there in that room watching an fbi series on netflix In spanish with english subtitles about an hour later another cop walked into the room Traded places with the first cop Changed the netflix channel to japanese anime And now they were watching japanese anime And by the way, the audios in japanese and the subtitles were in spanish Absolutely beyond ridiculous mind numbing stuff said george And every time the door opened he thought the commandant was ready to interview But the commandant had not arrived the hours passed They wouldn't let him make a phone call to the commandant arrive. The commandant did not arrive till eight at night

[17:38] George spent 10 hours in a room with a policeman watching netflix handcuffed the whole time When the commandant arrived, they let him make a phone call He phoned his gringle buddy who then phoned his lawyer his gringle buddy and lawyer arrived at nine So far 11 hours have passed Now remember no one in this police station speaks english However, george said there were cops coming and going all the time sometimes bringing in criminals shoplifters and stuff in to get processed He heard it all going on in the room next door. Oh, and yeah, they gave him water. Let him go to the bathroom Even offered him lunch and dinner which he refused he had no appetite All the while his cuffs were never removed until the commandant got there

[18:23] Well, then at nine o'clock He met his buddy's lawyer told him the story in front of the commandant Told him the whole saga of how the two cops never identified themselves and took him to a police station an hour away From the nearest one close to his home Told him that he'd panic told him that he went to a panama Relocation seminar and people were talking about the various ways you can get extorted by cops and cop imposters Well, the lawyer castigated the commandant said they had violated this gringo's human rights Number one the cops have to identify themselves number two They had no right to take his phone away because he had not been charged with a crime They had no right to cuff him because they were not in danger and he had not been charged nor suspected of a crime And finally the lawyer said the law states if a guy does not speak spanish

[19:09] They must provide an english speaking translator for him and that was the commandant's loophole He said that's why it took so long to get to his case He said a lawyer had just arrived from the prokura dora's office That would be the legal office a lawyer who was a hundred percent bilingual Well, no one even got to talk to that guy because within five minutes George's new lawyer the gringo buddy's lawyer Went into another room with the commandant had a short meeting came back in and said All right, we're free to go. He said let's just chuck this up to a misunderstanding and we'll all forget about it So then george his gringo buddy and his new lawyer walked out to the parking lot and the lawyer said george That's exactly why you have to have a lawyer on speed dial Because you see the police down here can be kind of rough when dealing with people

[19:55] In other words if the local peniminians get picked up They don't know if their rights are being abused or not the police treat them sort of harshly Sometimes they get knocked around a bit. Sometimes they end up in jail for a couple of days when they didn't do anything Sometimes people pay bribes george got the point. All right Then he said to the lawyer They originally brought me down here because I didn't have the paperwork in my car What about that? Do I have to do anything? Do I have to bring it down and show them? The lawyer said nope, it's all over But make sure you leave them in the glove compartment when you get back home and make sure they're not the originals They are copies Then george said but what did you say to the commandant when you spoke privately to him? The commandant's rank by the way was a colonel The lawyer said I made a deal. I told him I wouldn't file any of the five or six

[20:44] prisoner and human rights violations I saw If he'd call it a misunderstanding and let you walk an easy choice for him Because if I file charges he'll have to go to court and bring the people involved It'll be an embarrassing waste of time and bad pr for tourism You won't have a hearing in court for three or four months and you'll have to go down and testify too And he said that cop that was sitting in the car next to you who took your phone. He'll get fired The other motorcycle cop too Then george says well the guy on the motorcycle. He was pretty nice to me He was civil and everything was the guy in the car. I wouldn't mind to see him get fired He said they'll both get fired. Do you want that to happen? And george said yeah, you're right Let's just call it a lesson learned and all that Then the lawyer said to george now for some major words of wisdom

[21:33] If you would have had me on speed dial Or in this case what's up because everyone here in latin america uses what's up your little confrontation with those cops would have ended In about three minutes You'd have never had to go down to the police station in the first place Oh and the second moral of that story is if you're gonna live down here in latin america learn some spanish At least maybe 60 to 80 percent conversationally fluent enough to get by All right moving on you want to hear about how I got scammed the other day. Yeah Yeah, right johnny the all-knowing expert expat gets scammed sometimes too Luckily, it was a minor penny ante scam, but hey still aggravating, right? So here's what happened You know down here in latin america at most all busy street corners in low-end sections of town mostly

[22:20] There are people walking up to your car when you're at the stoplight or stop sign trying to sell you stuff besides that There's usually a one-legged beggar or two Those obnoxious window washer guys, you know They spray water on your windshield and try to wipe it off with a dirty squeegee or a rag Then they hold out their hands expecting a half a buck tip for smearing up your windshield And give you a dirty look if you don't cough up man If you drive a lot down here in latin america, it's one thing you'll learn to hate Well, you know along with those windshield washer guys, they've got guys selling windshield wipers Yep, they're walking around with a handful of windshield wipers And when you're stopped there at a stoplight or stop sign They'll walk right up to your car lift your windshield wiper and shake their head in disbelief

[23:09] As if there's something really wrong with your existing wipers and thus you'll have to buy one from them And of course he'll install it before the light changes That kind of thing's been going on for years and i've never fallen for it yet Why because well windshield wipers come in different sizes and they're just carrying one or two sizes with them In fact, most of the cars today have a big wiper for the driver's side and a smaller one for the passenger side, right? The big one could be 18 19 20 even 24 inches and the small one 10 12 14 inches You'll never know yourself until you have to replace one I mean look if I asked you right now, tell me the length of your windshield wipers. I'm sure 95 percent of you would have no idea There are probably 15 common windshield wiper links that you could buy at a car part store

[23:59] And these fools walking between your car trying to sell you a windshield wipers are only carrying two or three of those sizes Forget about it. Unless you have a broken wiper and need a quick fix Anyway, just last saturday. I parked my car in a busy shopping area I went to a hardware store or something and anyway when I got back to my car as soon as I got in a scruffy Street urchin guy appeared out of nowhere with a handful of windshield wipers Anyway, he lifted up the main wiper now I hate when people touch my car So I wasn't too happy about that and sure enough there was a place where the rubber was detaching from the plastic So I thought hell Okay, i'll buy one was something like four bucks. He said what about the other one? You know, they come in pairs and they deteriorate in pairs I said okay. Okay, so he fished out a smaller one and hooked it up

[24:45] And to my surprise they look to be the same size as the original ones which I later found out they weren't the smaller one Was supposed to be 15 inches But he only put in a 12 and you only find that out when there's a heavy rain Then you see the watermarks where the wiper can't reach So anyway, all the while this was happening. There was a little guy with two five gallon buckets washing cars along the street You see that a lot down here, especially in busy districts where people park on the street There'll be a guy out there every day One freeze block it seems and has a couple of buckets some rags and water and he'll wash your car for two or three bucks Sometimes it's better than sitting in line at a car wash and paying five or ten bucks

[25:31] Especially when your car is only dirty on the outside Personally, i'd never let one of those guys inside my car to clean it up, but some people do Anyway, just as I was about to leave my parking spot The car wash guy comes up to me knocks out of my window and I said no, thanks. No, thanks He said no problem. I just wanted to tell you that guy who sells windshield wipers He knows how to damage yours to get you to buy his I said what what do you mean? He says he's got a razor blade in his fingers when he lifts your wipers I thought oh I get it. I've been scammed He detaches a bit of rubber where it meets the plastic so it looks damaged it is damaged He said I just thought you might want to know for next time So in the end I was out five bucks. That's what it cost me for those wipers

[26:18] Well, actually it cost me around 10 bucks because when I caught the first big rain I realized the small wiper was too small So I had to go out to the hardware store and buy a new one if I see that guy again I'm gonna whip him with his own blades I know I know it was only 10 bucks, but who likes to get scammed who needs the aggravation you feel like an idiot Oops, we're getting towards the end of the show now one last email from alphonts. He said johnny When you were talking about the massive rise of bitcoin on your previous show I was one of those guys who finally got in at five thousand. I bought two bitcoins Then I did what you recommended let it ride Don't get fixated on the daily prices. In fact, I carried it a bit too far I just let it ride as a passive investment. I rarely check the spot prices at all

[27:08] I'm in it for the long haul. I'm one of those hodlers. So so what? Who needs to make an obsession out of it? Last time I looked last time I paid any attention. It was around 60 000 and then you mentioned how it was skyrocketing So I checked again and damn it was 98 000 for one bitcoin I'll tell you made my butt hairs stand up First time that ever happened You've been listening to the expat files living in latin america If you need some help with your own plan b we can schedule a one-on-one phone or skype consult Just send me an email the expat files at gmail.com And if you want to get on the waiting list for my next week long expat insider seminar in central america Where you're guaranteed to get a two to five year head start on your plan b

[27:55] Send me an email the expat files at gmail.com